Speaker 1: 0:00

Welcome to another edition of Give an Ovation, the restaurant guest experience podcast, where I talk to industry experts to get their strategies and tactics you can use to create a five-star guest experience. This podcast is sponsored by Ovation, an operations and guest recovery platform for multi-unit restaurants that gives all the answers without annoying guests with all the questions. Learn more at OvationUpcom. And today we have Peter Romeo, an icon of the industry and a pillar of hospitality news. He has interviewed the best of the best because he is the best of the best. Peter, welcome to the podcast.

Speaker 2: 0:37

Well, thank you very much and thanks for your kind words. Those, really, the translation is a mold and been around a long time, but we're going to be here.

Speaker 1: 0:46

Right before we hit record, we were talking a little bit about. You know, I lived in Harlem and Peter, you're from New York and you live in Long Island, and so we were talking about Harlem and how Harlem has changed over the years. So when I first got to Harlem and I wanted to share this story with you it's so funny because it was just becoming really nice right when I first got to Harlem and I wanted to share the story with you, it's so funny because it was just becoming really nice right Harlem was kind of just on that change and I lived in kind of a weird building. I lived in the 13th floor of a 10 story building and so have you seen those buildings where they have like an old elevator shaft, like a counterweight?

Speaker 2: 1:21

Oh, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 1:22

And so they convert those. They converted those, those into extra floors, but there's no elevator that goes up there. So I take an elevator up to the 10th floor, walk across the building, then walk up the stairs, the elevator shaft. So anyway, I'm living there and I go out with this girl and she'd lived in Utah her whole life, never lived in New York, and here she was all of a sudden plopped down in Harlem, right next to me, and so we go out on this date and it's like 2 am.

Speaker 1: 1:45

We're walking down the street and this guy has a backpack slung over his shoulder and he's like we walked by and he's like kind of whispering. He's like Adobe, adobe, y'all want some Adobe. And she goes what's Adobe? And I was like I don't know. It's been a minute since. I've like I don't know what the street name of Adobe is for. So I go over to him and I'm like oh, I asked her. I said have you ever seen drugs? And she's like no, I've never even seen drugs. I was like let's go talk to him. So I go up to this guy and again, keep in mind, 2 am, streets of Harlem, things are right in the transition period, and I was like all right no-transcript club memberships.

Speaker 2: 2:54

So that is a great story and very telling. Marcus Samuelson, who of course now has turned Harlem into his prize market, he tells a story where when he first got a restaurant up there, when he first got Red Rooster, he would walk to work from his house, I think on the Upper East Side, and he said he'd passed five drug houses. Now it's five rehab clinics and lots of signs for real estate available. So it's really undergone quite a transformation. So, but that's a that's a good story. Indeed, new York is never without its adventures, for sure.

Speaker 1: 3:31

Yeah, so now, how did you, Peter, go from a New York socialite to a to like the, the hospitality just icon that you've become Like? What? What happened along that journey to get you into the hospitality news sector?

Speaker 2: 3:49

It was a combination of serendipity and planning. I was part of what was called the All the President's Men journalism boom. I remember going to orientation at journalism school at NYU and our professor saying if every working journalist resigned tomorrow, you still wouldn't be enough jobs to just take up our class. So I think we had 7,800 kids in that class. So when I came out, the only jobs available were in the trade publications and needed to eat. It's funny how that happens.

Speaker 2: 4:23

So I got involved in that and clearly saw that the restaurant industry is a great business to cover. It's filled with cowboys. It's filled with nonconformists, people who definitely march to their own drummer, people who can make a really a killing, a lot of money, quickly if they work hard and have a good idea. And people don't care what your pedigree is, what your education is. It's really what you're all about, and that really resonated with me. So, by design, I managed to get a job covering restaurants, and that was it'll be 40 years ago, this November. So the business has changed quite a bit since then, but it's been a good ride for sure.

Speaker 1: 5:02

So, as you're looking at like people who have made it in the restaurant industry, what are some common traits that you've?

Speaker 2: 5:09

seen. Undoubtedly a huge trait is that they're better listeners than they are talkers. That is just so crucial because you're trying to understand people, you're trying to get to the heart of behavior, whether you're talking about a customer or, equally as important employees and to some degree, even investors. You got to sort of have a sense of what their psyche is all about, and that takes a. There's an art to that. The other thing is that they are truly rebels.

Speaker 2: 5:38

It really is a matter of looking at how it's always been done and thinking I can do it better, let me give it a try, let me take a chance, and that's why we get so much innovation in the business. It's constantly being reinvented, but that takes a set. You've got to be willing to put yourself out there and really bomb, and a lot of folks that we know as great successes today have their skeletons in the closet. They've paid their dues, they've had their failures, but no doubt that's the case and it's a cliche. But you got to be a people person. You're dealing with people all the time and if you don't like that, if you're an introvert, you might have a little bit of a tough time. So you got to put yourself out there and again, equally for employees as much as guests, though the guests appreciate it as well.

Speaker 1: 6:29

And you know, I think that's so well said about being a people person. And one thing I found the common trait of people people is and it's interesting that you say listening and people, people, a people person, right, Because those two don't when you think about it at first. When you say listening and people, people, a people person, right, Because those two don't when you think about it at first, you think about a people person. You think about someone who's just like blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, like talking all the time.

Speaker 1: 6:53

But what I found is the most common attribute of people who genuinely like people is they are so curious, not into what someone does, but into why they do that, what are their motivations behind what that person does? And when you can dive into the motivation, you can truly understand that. That's where you get the life lessons and that's where you don't have to ask a thousand questions, because that singular motivation answers a thousand questions. And when you get down to that level, that's where you can really show that you care about people and that's what makes people feel seen and heard and hence they give it back to those people, people, and that's what they thrive on, is that connection, and it's not just being on stage, but it's being in a conversation, you know, yeah, oh no doubt about it.

Speaker 2: 7:46

I would go so far as to say, whenever I talk with a CEO, whenever I talk with someone heading a big chain, the most delightful time of their workday or the most delightful time of their work career is when they go out into units and talk with employees and talk with guests. Surprisingly, I can tell you as a formula if you are an isolated CEO, if you are someone who is dependent on the yes. People around you and not getting into the field and listening and hearing what guests and employees have to say, you're not going to be around for very long. It's getting into the field and making that connection and seeing what happens where the rubber hits the road that makes all the difference. And I don't know of a CEO who wouldn't rather be out in a unit cooking than in a board meeting, and I think that says a lot for the people who are drawn to our industry and what it takes to succeed. For sure and I've been fortunate I've seen a lot of tremendous successes and a lot of spectacular failures as well.

Speaker 1: 8:51

So it's very interesting to watch for sure, and I think one thing that I've noticed is that when there's been a spectacular failure, one of the most common things I've seen is a lack of focus on putting the guest first. And there's, you know. Whether it's the location, is this a good location for the guest? Whether it's the food is this the right food for the guest? Whether it's the employees am I equipping my employees to create a great guest experience, everything along the line. If you start with a guest in mind and work your way through, you're going to usually have a good experience there in terms of the business. But I'd love to get your thoughts on like what do you think are some of the most important aspects of guest experience? And, by the way, do you agree with that assessment?

Speaker 2: 9:42

Yes, I most definitely do. You know, just to cite and sort of a touchstone when it comes to concepts that didn't live up to their hype Boston Market, when they first hit the scene at Boston Chicken, they would have these elaborate presentations about the economics and what went into it, but, ps, they forgot to ask the guests what they really wanted. And so they got great locations and they were expecting to do I remember the volume 1.1, 1.2 million and instead guests were not that turned on by the concept, so came in a little short, came in about 700, 800,000 per store, and that's when it started to devolve In terms of the guests, the importance to the guests or the importance of the guests. That's really what it comes down to. But there again, no one knows that guest better than the employees and without that crucial input as well, you're kind of chasing your tail.

Speaker 2: 10:40

We saw that in droves in the pandemic. You know, the pandemic really caught a lot of seasoned restaurateurs off balance because of course it was unprecedented and there were no handbooks, there were no guidelines, and quite a few found that the best solutions were ones that came up, that rose up from the lowest level, employees saying, hey, what if we did this? What if we did that? What if we sold our supplies, since customers aren't coming in but we know people are having a tough time getting into grocery stores and finding stuff. What if we turned ourselves into a grocery store? And I mean, the examples just go on and on and on. So, yeah, it's absolutely essential and we're at a point right now where the industry is really kind of gasping a little because of the slowdown in traffic.

Speaker 2: 11:27

So the number one rule hands down it's always been there, but it's never been more paramount than it is now Don't disappoint the guest, don't make them feel like they didn't get their money's worth, don't make them feel like they wasted the calories and wasted the cash. And that is just so essential in every respect, whether it's the quality of the food, the volume of the food as Chipotle learned when the staff started cutting down their portions a little it's the whole sort of ambiance, the whole feeling, and today, with all the loyalty programs that are out there, it's an interaction and a conversation and a task that you, as a service provider, face. It goes beyond the restaurant, it goes into your home too. So you've got to be able to deliver on all those fronts. And if you disappoint that guest, he or she, they're going to abandon you because they can find someone else out there who will, for sure.

Speaker 1: 12:24

Oh yeah, I talk about this ozempic and recession cocktail that's going on right now, where people are tightening their belt loops and they're tightening their purse strings and they're eating out less and they're spending less when they eat out and when we've taken price and taken price and taken price, and we've kind of reached a ceiling where they're saying guests are saying enough enough.

Speaker 1: 12:47

They're saying guests are saying enough enough. And here's the thing when they pay their hard-earned money and eat their hard-earned calories, they want it to be right. And if it's not right, we need to have a way to make it right and to hear about that, because we should be in constant conversation with our guests, because now more than ever, peter, I'm sure you're seeing this this year 2024, is the most expensive year in the history of the world at winning a new customer into your restaurant. We can't afford to lose them to someone else and we can't afford to get out of the rotation of these restaurants, because, on average, a guest is going to come into a restaurant once every eight months, and if we fall out of that, I mean it's going to be a couple of years before we can get them to come back. And so it's important that we make sure that we're keeping them in mind, we keep them the top of mind and, yeah, that we're providing the value that you're talking about Super key. I love that.

Speaker 2: 13:49

Yeah, and there's no doubt about it, and people will spend if it's worth it, if it's worth if it's an extraordinary circumstance. Two of the sectors that are doing best right now are high-end steakhouses, so average ticket. There we're talking a pretty big layout of money, and the same thing with seafood, and it's a matter of they're going to treat themselves, they're going to go out and not be afraid to spend some money, but they want a wow experience Because guess what?

Speaker 1: 14:17

I'm not going to dinner and a movie anymore.

Speaker 2: 14:20

I'm going to dinner or a movie, right.

Speaker 1: 14:23

That's exactly it, because I can't afford both. So when I go out to eat, I want to feel like I got my entertainment for the night as well. Now I don't need my server to put on a show, right. But it's about that hospitality, it's about that connection, that interaction, making sure that I got what I paid for, because going to Five Guys nowadays, I mean, that's as expensive as going to the movie with soda, popcorn, candy, oh, for sure. Yeah so.

Speaker 1: 14:50

I think, it's really interesting. So, in all of the interviews that you've done, do you have any tactics to help improve the guest experience?

Speaker 2: 14:58

I think the biggest thing is if you can convince your frontline employees, whether they be servers or people at the counter, to be human, to just basically drop the plasticky hi, my name is Peter and I'm here to wait on you and just be a human boy. That just changes the whole tenor of the experience. Then, all of a sudden, you're at someone's table, you're at someone who's there to please you. Now that's the hard thing to do because it's so simple, it's so hard, but that's basically it. And I guess the other thing and you think it'd be obvious but know your customer. It gets back to what you said about the motivation, and so he was indulging him and it took about 20 minutes for the guy to get a sandwich, but he was a happy customer. So I think it was a matter of that kid waiting on that customer. Knew that customer, knew what he wanted, knew what the lifetime value of that customer was, and there you go.

Speaker 2: 16:17

The other thing is you know, loyalty programs are great. I have a ton of apps on my phone and I use them as a consumer as well as a journalist. But you know, nothing's better than that personal touch, nothing's better than a note on your tab thanks for coming in, or better than a note on your tab thanks for coming in or sorry about the cold soup next time dinner's on us or something like that. So you know, that personal touch, that humanizing aspect, is really the biggest thing that you can deliver, but probably the hardest thing you could deliver. And other than that, you know, our business on one level is really simple give people what they want that's really what it comes down to, and figure out a way to make money at it. But that's the easy part. It's making sure that they're satisfied. You'll make money if you have a happy customer, for sure.

Speaker 1: 17:06

As one of my longtime advisors and great friends, kelly McPherson. She's the Danny Meyer CTO, and one of the things she always says is what we're doing here in the hospitality industry it's not rocket surgery and I think that just makes a lot of sense because it's really the foundational, the simplest elements of people want to feel seen and they want to feel fed, and if you could help them get full in both of those aspects, then, to your point, peter, you're going to have a great success. Now I've got a really tough question for you. Okay, because there isn't a brand, there isn't a person in this industry that you don't know. The question is who is someone that deserves an ovation? Who's someone that we should be following? Who is someone that deserves an ovation? Who's someone that we should be following.

Speaker 2: 17:54

There are some folks out there who really deserve special attention. The CEO of Texas Roadhouse he stepped in after the founder, jerry Morgan, his name is. He stepped in after the founder, who was a friend of his, had committed suicide. And Kent Taylor, the guy who died. He was a huge, larger than life figure and Jerry came in there and he had to deal with the emotional aspect. He had to deal with the business aspect. He really had a lot of dynamics going on. Plus, he had his own restaurants as a area developer and he led them through that and I so admire the man, not only for his business acumen but really for his leadership. The other thing is to keep an eye, maybe not so much on people, although that's worthwhile as well, but also in terms of concepts. Wingstop it should be tested for enhancement drugs because it's unbelievable. I mean they had a 45% two-year same-store sales increase last quarter when everyone else was showing declines. Their CEO, michael I'm drawing a blank on his last name, but he is quite the guy Kevin Hockman at Chili's he's kind of a quiet guy. He came over from Yum, from Taco Bell, and he came in there and he didn't walk into the most comfortable situations. He found that there was a lot of things wrong and he's quietly sort of re-engineered things in a way that makes sense, but in a way that made waves, and there's nothing tougher than that. And he's done just an admirable job at that. The list goes on and on and on. The folks at Dutch Bros those guys have really sort of proved the importance of hospitality.

Speaker 2: 19:50

You mentioned Danny Meyer. Danny Meyer continues to just kill it. If you go to Provisions, his retail concept, it's a store, it's a food store. We've all been in a gazillion of them. But you go in there and you come out and say, wow, that was special. There's something that he can do. And everyone of course knows Danny Meyer. They might not be as familiar with the Millman children Rich Millman's children in Chicago who have actually done the rare feat of taking down a hugely successful operation and made it even more successful. The folks the two boys and their sister who run that. They are just doing a fantastic job, rj and the rest of them. So there's a ton of heroes out there who probably are more focused on succeeding or doing right by their constituencies than in grabbing the limelight. But boy do they deserve attention and boy, do they deserve praise for what they've done?

Speaker 1: 20:45

Awesome, what a fantastic list. Yeah, those are some incredible people. Definitely would love to follow them and have them on the podcast, learn more from them. Speaking of learning more, peter, where can people go to learn more from you?

Speaker 2: 20:58

Well, restaurantbusinessonlinecom is our website. We have five of the most seasoned veterans in the business, myself included, jonathan Mays, lisa Jennings We've got a great team and we are hyperactive. So there's a lot of information there. And if you want to learn about the history of the industry, a little bit of the color and about some of those cowboys and some of those unique characters, I do a blog where I go back and look at some of those individuals and it's really, yes, the objective is to cast more color, or to provide more color, on what's happening today, but a lot of it's entertainment. So we look at great villains from the past and great successes and stories you might not have known. So we have a lot of fun there. So the blog is called Restaurant Rewind. It's on all of the various services, but you can also download it from Restaurant Business Online.

Speaker 1: 21:54

Awesome. Well, peter, for having an incredible career that is still at the top of things and feeding us the needed news. Today's ovation goes to you. Thank you so much for joining us on Give an Ovation.

Speaker 2: 22:06

Thank you very much for having me and best of luck to everyone, and thank you to the industry for being such a great business to cover.

Speaker 1: 22:12

Thanks, for joining us today. If you liked this episode, leave us a review on Apple Podcasts or your favorite place to listen. We're all about feedback here. Again, this episode was sponsored by Ovation, a two-question, sms-based actionable guest feedback platform built for multi-unit restaurants. If you'd like to learn how we can help you measure and create a better guest experience, visit us at OvationUpcom.